Active Active   Unanswered Unanswered

WOW are cruiser prices falling or what?

If it doesn't pertain to metal, wood, wire or fabric—but it is about vintage Chris-Crafts, ask your question or give your advice here.

Moderators: Don Vogt, Al Benton, Don Ayers

User avatar
BrokenRule2
Posts: 294
Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:56 pm
Location: North California Delta
Contact:

WOW are cruiser prices falling or what?

Post by BrokenRule2 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:17 am

In the last few weeks I have seen some nice sounding/looking cruisers going cheap. eBay had a 36 1967 Connie for about $2K. This 1959 32 Commander is going for $3750 - that is less than a new paint job - which it has! http://sacramento.craigslist.org/boa/2170488115.html
AND... they are crushing a 40'+ 1958/9 Connie near me that sank at the dock and the owner walked away - no one wanted it.

Makes me think twice about the work plan, new isolation trans, battery charger, batteries next month and the scheduled bottom & hull paint in October!

Are we cruisers going to get to the point where the scrap iron and full tanks of full are the only value in our boats?

Oh, any one in Northern Cal know where I can pick-up a cast iron exhaust Y for a 283... mine has developed a small hole and I would hate to have to ship cast iron!

Thanks for allowing me to vent. We expect 70's this weekend and perhaps I'll get some value out of her fishin' on Saturday... pending no fog!

Mike

User avatar
Matt Smith
Posts: 917
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2005 4:14 pm
Location: Reedville VA,
Contact:

Post by Matt Smith » Fri Jan 21, 2011 5:36 am

Remember back a ways when you could find a runabout in someones yard that was worth 20 bucks.. I do, and kick myself for not buying one then. The issue here is not the love of these boats but the repair cost and storage. A simple bottom repair can cost 20K so its not the cost of the boat but the cost of ownership. BUT... These boats slam dunk are the coolest cruisers on the water, they ride better, and drip with character. NO boat is going to be an investment. Go look at a 3 year old Sea Ray.. ITs half of what is was worth. In a strange way of looking at things. If you buy a nice 1956 something for 3,500 bucks today.. It might actually go p in value.. But that 3 year old sea ray aint.. And will look about as cool as those shoulder pads you had in your sport coat in the 80's.. Stay true to your good taste and style. The water ways need you to keep them interesting.
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman
1937 16' Special Racer
1968 40' Rice Trawler
1968 11' Crab Skiff
2018 Hole in my head

WoodyBoater.com

cmeke0870
Posts: 203
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2009 12:35 pm
Location: Columbia, S.C.

Post by cmeke0870 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:10 am

I've noticed this too. Bought my 30' Express for $5000 last year and it was in pretty good shape. I chose to put on a new bottom but could have just repaired what was there. It had new wiring, new engine, and looked pretty good. In the process of hunting, I saw several boats that were in pretty good shape for less than 10K. And I see some being given away. Your right--its the cost of ownership. Its sad. A silver lining I would rather not have is that the remaining boats may be worth a lot more one day.
Chuck Thompson

1950 30' Express Cruiser Restoration
1955 18' Continental

User avatar
rpccc43
Posts: 235
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2007 2:18 pm
Location: Irondequoit, NY

Post by rpccc43 » Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:20 pm

Ouch,ouch,& ouch,

I have been watching prices on cruisers erode steadily over the last 5 years since I paid $15K (way too much apparently) for my 43' Connie 5 years ago. And my lady needed and still does need a lot of work. I planned on it being a 10 year project and figured I could a least get my investment back when I was done. Not sure I could at this point.

Mikes question is a good one..do we keep going or cut our losses stop the bleeding? Storage is a killer too, $5k per year.I have elected to keep going on the premise that when I am done I'll have a boat I never could have afforded otherwise for a total of about $30k.

As a summer cottage it's cheap waterfront real estate. The fact I can go places with it is a bonus. At some point I will move her South out of the miserable climate we have in the Northeast and call her my retirement home. As long as she lasts as long as I do, I'll be happy.

Randman

Wood Commander
Posts: 885
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:48 pm
Location: Seattle area

Post by Wood Commander » Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:10 pm

Where I'm originally from, the Great Lakes area, wooden cruisers have had next to no value forever, probably since shortly after the fiberglass era got a good hold and the wooden boat era ended.

In addition to all of the extra costs of handling a cruiser, you really need to keep them in covered mmoorage and storage. Many of them die from water and weather from above. Once the cabin windows leak at the rear edge and damage the main aft cabin bulkhead, for example, they can be way past cost effective restoration.

Out in the Seattle area, they have much more covered moorage than I was used to, and the potential for year round usage, and cruisers in that region seem to have higher values.

Now here in Texas, I looked at a 37' Roamer that needed some work but was a really cool boat. When I looked it up in The Essential Guide, I saw that it weighed nearly twice what my similiarly sized mahogany Commander weighs, and it has the 427 Fords.
If auto gas hits $4 a gallon this summer, it will probably go to near $6 a gallon at marinas, Yikes!
Bret

1953 35' Commander "Adonis III"

1970 23' lancer project

User avatar
Captain Nemo
Posts: 691
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:40 pm
Location: Lyons, NY

Post by Captain Nemo » Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:23 am

Matt is right, these wood cruisers have more class in their sternpost than a plastic Sea Ray has in the whole boat.
I consider myself fortunate to have bought my latest 28'er for 4000. three years ago. She's a go boat, not a show boat but, I would rather be seen on her than any piece of tupperware any day.
It's getting harder to find wood boat friendly yards these days also. If my marina wasn't literally walking distance from my home @ $20.00/ft. inside storage I probably couldn't afford my cruiser.
Keep the faith guys, save these old girls from the saw :cry: .
-Mark

SEMPER NAVES LIGNEAE!
Last edited by Captain Nemo on Sat Jan 22, 2011 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
Boats are to be made of wood, otherwise, God would have grown fiberglass trees.

User avatar
evansjw44
Posts: 1865
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:46 am
Location: Grosse Pointe Farms, MI

Hey Bret

Post by evansjw44 » Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:47 am

Look for an aluminum Roamer. They weigh about the same as a wood boat the same size. If you look hard you can find 37 AL Roamers with 8V53 Detroits and that'll give you some fuel savings at good speed. I'd love to have one but since I'm retired I don't have the coin. I'll just have to keep my Corinthian.
Jim Evans

User avatar
BrokenRule2
Posts: 294
Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:56 pm
Location: North California Delta
Contact:

Post by BrokenRule2 » Sat Jan 22, 2011 10:08 am

Ran into a guy that just bought a 1959 CALMAR woody. He does not know the real brand name as the boat has no nameplates and the title just has CALMAR.

He said he paid $7K for it because that how much the recenty installed electronics cost. New windless, remote spot light, radio and killer radar system and mounting tower.

His quote was, got the electronics for $7K and the boat for free!

So I guess there is hope if you add the right stuff.

Just going over the long term plan of ours so the bost is like new when I hit retirement. Hull paint next winter or 2012, finish the electrical system this year (isolation trans, charger and four new AGM batteries), possible holding tank and new fresh water system soon... new canvas and cover in a two years... new exhaust manifolds in five years... refasten in ten years & paint... done and ready to enjoy for a few years and repeat!

Work plan would equal about the same as payments on a nice newer boat. So if I can just get over the fact I will have no residual value is ten years - I'll be fine!

I think it is still cost effective berthing it than having to pay for covered land based storage and making payments on related costs for a truck for a trailer boat. I know it is a lot less stressful not towing!

So as long as I have a great support group of addictive woody boaters and the admiral who loves the boat threatens that if the boat goes I better go with it... I'll make it to retirement!

we are off to go fishin. I'll post a photo upon my return.

Mike

kcupido
Posts: 106
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2007 9:54 am
Location: Sault Ste. Marie, ON

Post by kcupido » Sat Jan 22, 2011 11:58 am

It's a sad fact about the fate of our beloved Cruisers. I believe we have to have a bit of a crazy streak for owning such a beautiful vessel.
I paid too much for mine because I believed it to be a solid boat, only to discover how rotted it really was! So I sunk another $20,000 into her to repair the damage only to find out that all of the teak decking needed to be replaced also.
No big problem until I lost my job and hope now to be able to continue to pay for her storage costs.
So she sits in storage awaiting new decking, unable to be used in the state she is in, unable to sell her for the same reason. (And the fact that very few of us really want this kind of boat.)
But I am hopeful. One day her repairs will be done and I'll be able to enjoy her beauty, her history, her wet wood smell that reminds me of the joy of owning such a classic.
Til then, I hope she doesn't turn into dust or worse yet sent to the bon fire because no one could afford to keep her.

User avatar
BrokenRule2
Posts: 294
Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:56 pm
Location: North California Delta
Contact:

Post by BrokenRule2 » Tue Jan 25, 2011 9:48 pm

Here is the fishing photo, San Pablo Bay by the entrance to the Petaluma River buoy #4, sorry no fish!

Image

Abnormal weather out here on the bay, mid 60's, no fog, no wind.

The fish are normally biting Jan - March but the fish finder did not pick up one hit on the trip from Napa to San Pablo bay then back to the home port.

Stuffing box is fixed but the fish finder reported 15V on the trip back... I warmed up the batteries. No I need to look into that problem.

This should not have been an issue as I cruise under 3000 RPM and voltage has only been a problem if the RPMs remain over 3500.

While at Napa getting the stuffing boxes fixed we got a number of complements and the admiral was all smiles. So the investment has it's returns in her eyes.

No if we could just find the fish...

Mike

cmeke0870
Posts: 203
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2009 12:35 pm
Location: Columbia, S.C.

Post by cmeke0870 » Wed Jan 26, 2011 1:46 pm

Ditto the above. Like randman, I figure for less than the cost of nice glass boat, I have an extremely cool boat. Its also less than a summer cottage and I can move it around (albeit not cheaply)to different locales. Dang--can't wait to finish my restore and get her in the wasser!
Chuck Thompson

1950 30' Express Cruiser Restoration
1955 18' Continental

jahearne
Posts: 419
Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:31 pm
Location: San Francisco

Post by jahearne » Thu Jan 27, 2011 2:46 pm

The only problem I see is resisting temptation not to snatch up another one (we're not hear to make a profit just caretakers for the next generation to enjoy). Where are we going to put them all? Already I'm paying rent on 3 boats two years into my new hobby.

Time to rethink forming a group marina again.
http://www.chris-craft.org/discussion/v ... php?t=5018
John & Wendy

User avatar
Matt Smith
Posts: 917
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2005 4:14 pm
Location: Reedville VA,
Contact:

Post by Matt Smith » Thu Jan 27, 2011 2:59 pm

HA, I still think the group marina is a cool idea. And yes, a home for old cruisers.. Both in human and boat form.. I have a domain I am dying to use.. OldBoatsHome.com We can all just sit and complain about how young folks these days dont care, and just drive around in our boats.. UNTIL they need sanding.. Then those youn'ns are usefull..
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman
1937 16' Special Racer
1968 40' Rice Trawler
1968 11' Crab Skiff
2018 Hole in my head

WoodyBoater.com

User avatar
rpccc43
Posts: 235
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2007 2:18 pm
Location: Irondequoit, NY

Post by rpccc43 » Thu Jan 27, 2011 3:34 pm

Group Marina ...That's an outstanding idea..especially for those of us starting the early stages of thinking about retirement!! Let's see... located on big big water in middle America...minimal adverse weather....covered slips..affordable...nearby airport...cheap hired labor..nearby pubs....what else guys?

Randman

jahearne
Posts: 419
Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:31 pm
Location: San Francisco

Post by jahearne » Thu Jan 27, 2011 3:35 pm

--- OLD BOATS HOME ---

A home for old cruisers,
...boats and humans.



I love it!
over the dock will be a sign "BOATS"
over the bar will be a sign "HUMANS"
John & Wendy

User avatar
BrokenRule2
Posts: 294
Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:56 pm
Location: North California Delta
Contact:

Post by BrokenRule2 » Thu Jan 27, 2011 6:17 pm

I even had an idea for the old woodies that would not float... :idea:

Boat & Breakfast :!:

Picture a nice dock with a dozen or more beautiful cruisers all resting nicely with electric, water and waste connected from below... :shock:

Now picture in place of water - flowing grass in the wind acting like waves as the whole deal is set-up on land - out in the quite of the country.

Fit me with the straight jacket now and haul me off! :D

jahearne
Posts: 419
Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:31 pm
Location: San Francisco

Post by jahearne » Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:29 pm

Some marinas in the Delta have small trailer parks. We can swap out the trailers for Mike's B&B idea... !!!
John & Wendy

User avatar
Al Benton
Club Executive Team
Posts: 3549
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:41 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO

Post by Al Benton » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:01 am

Now here's another possibility for a restoration project.

Image

This guy is having fun and turning a buck in the process. The Gypsy Rose

Al

User avatar
Delta Moon
Posts: 80
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 2:56 pm
Location: Long Beach California

group Home

Post by Delta Moon » Fri Jan 28, 2011 10:41 am

Well here in Southern California, there is a group home for old woodies. It is called Newmarks Marina in wilmington Ca. There are some old classic's, that sad to say may never see the ocean again, Dean Martins old yacht True Love is there, she is a 55 connie, there is a 60 foolter as well,. and a 100 footer called from the 20's. as well as many other smaller wood boats.

Sad to see as One can only know the former Glory these ladies once cruised with.

jfrprops
Posts: 2089
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:41 pm
Location: Powhatan Courthouse Virginia

Post by jfrprops » Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:14 pm

My previous post on this subject did NOT show up here?
The "group marina" exist for me right now.
Queen's Creek Marina, Mathews Virginia on the BAY.
We have ten covered slips.
Some of our classic cruisers include:
My 1966 33 foot Cavalier Seastrake Chris Craft
A sixtys 42 foot Trojan motor yacht
a Mid sixtys Tiffany 32 sport fisherman
A 1937 Elco 38 footer
really a comfort zone for us all.

John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)

jfrprops
Posts: 2089
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:41 pm
Location: Powhatan Courthouse Virginia

Post by jfrprops » Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:12 pm

A contributing cause for the Cruiser Crash, yet unmentioned in this thread, it the age of Green guilt.
I even have to admit it seems oddly out of step with the times to pull up to the gas pump and take on 150 gallons, cost concerns aside.
Sure the signs of worse fuel waste abound, but on an individual level all the cruiser guys have to deal with the green guilt. That is a factor that limits the market, for sure.
John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)

gbraker
Posts: 575
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:22 am

green guilt

Post by gbraker » Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:36 pm

Guess what, if the gas wasn't purchased by someone, the price would probably go up because the oil companies want to make there fortunes. Therefor its up to us to buy as much fuel as we can possibly afford, and race around. Its good for the economy, provides jobs for marinas. Allows us to sell parts to each other, its a whole way of life, and its our responsibility to see that it continues. GUILT hell no I got no stinking guilt
Gary R Braker

jfrprops
Posts: 2089
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:41 pm
Location: Powhatan Courthouse Virginia

Post by jfrprops » Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:14 pm

I never said "stinking guilt" that was your phrase.
My thoughts were just something for the considerate to consider.... quite a diverse group we have here, that is a strength.

I bought a load of gas today. $ 3.49 per. But I keep and open mind to match my open wallet.

John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)

gbraker
Posts: 575
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:22 am

Post by gbraker » Sun Jan 30, 2011 9:15 am

All seriousness aside, I wonder where this is all going.

I bought my boat in 1989 after I got laid off my job of 18 years. Even with the severance pay I quickly realized that I couldn't afford a fiberglass boat. I looked all over and found my boat finally "30ft Connie"

I would never have been able to afford the boat if it had to be in a marina. I lived on a channel and the neighbor let me keep it in his lot in the winter, and the marina nearby lifted it in and out and brought it back & forth and all I had to do in return was take care of there phone system. I bought gas in 5 gallon cans and fueled the boat at my pier.

Now we are looking at 4 maybe 5 dollars a gallon.

I already drive slow on 1 engine most of the time.

You can't sell, no one is buying, and I can barely afford to use it. Now I have moved and I have to keep the boat in a marina for the winter. Now its even more expensive.

I know its not worth it to have the boat, but I love boating so I'll try to muddle along.

Its sure not getting any easier though, the older I get.
Gary R Braker

User avatar
Al Benton
Club Executive Team
Posts: 3549
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:41 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO

Post by Al Benton » Sun Jan 30, 2011 9:55 am

Gary, I think that many of us are in the same boat (pun definitely intended) with the cost of fuel, maintenance, and slip fees rising each year much faster than other things that we need. So it is the love of the hobby that keeps us spending what ever it takes to keep these old cruisers floating and moving. It certainly isn't a logical investment. Mine costs 4 or 5 thousand a year to keep.I probably spend more in a year than I could sell her for. The market is gone for these treasures, for now. Once the economic climate is back to normal that may change. Whether it does or not, I still enjoy keeping her going and using her when I can. With any luck, when I'm gone, someone else will become her steward and give her the attention she desperately needs.

Al

jfrprops
Posts: 2089
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:41 pm
Location: Powhatan Courthouse Virginia

Post by jfrprops » Sun Jan 30, 2011 12:15 pm

Thanks to Al and Gary for their sensitive comments on this issue.
I cruised yesterday and REQUIRE that peace and being on the water to level out things in this crazy world.

I, like Al, spend more in a year on the boat than it would bring.....notice I did not say "more than it is WORTH".....at any price it is priceless to me.

I really appreciate Gary's insights!

John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)

Wilson Wright
Posts: 559
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 9:44 pm
Location: Tallahassee, Florida
Contact:

CRuiser prices falling

Post by Wilson Wright » Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:34 pm

I see internet rumors that gas will be $7/gal by summer's end but interestingly enuf, gas prices on the street fell here this week from $3.06/to $3.03.

As for selling....for the serious seller, maybe this Meecum outfit is the way based on this weekend's selling prices...admitted those sold were not cruisers..
Wilson Wright
Executive Director Emeritus
Chris-Craft Antique Boat Club

gbraker
Posts: 575
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:22 am

Post by gbraker » Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:58 pm

Remember back to the 60's there would be gas wars. One place would have gas for 25.9, and another for 24.9 and so on. The prices would be within a few penny's of each other, but as a percentage it could be as much as 4 percent. Today a change from 3.09 to 3.03 is only 2 percent. They make a big deal out of a very small change.

You still see stations on the same block with basically the same price, but in a nearby city, probably served by the same distribution company its much more.

I mean who is kidding who, are these prices being fixed or what. Its all politics and big business running roughshod all over the peons. or is that the peed ons
Gary R Braker

ed laning
Posts: 269
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2005 6:10 pm
Location: spring lake, mi

Post by ed laning » Sun Jan 30, 2011 6:40 pm

The gas prices slowly come down penny by penny. It might be 3.09 at one place, 3.06 at another, still another might be 3.10 a couple miles away. Competition doing it's thing likely. Then we see one for 2.98 and rather suddenly, say the next day and seemingly all stations at the same time, they all go up about 20 cents to exactly the same price everywhere within miles. This process repeats itself time and time again.
1978 22' CC Dory outboard

gbraker
Posts: 575
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:22 am

Post by gbraker » Sun Jan 30, 2011 6:58 pm

Right and I'm sure none of those people know each other.

Maybe those in Egypt have the right idea, they are tired of being messed over by the establishment.
Gary R Braker

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest