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chris craft bungs

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chris craft bungs

Post by mcisaac inc » Sat Apr 12, 2008 1:31 pm

i couldn't help but notice the poor bung quality on the capri pictured in the winter brass bell on page 21. no way those bungs came out of that quartersawn transom plank. it looks like they made some mistakes too.some of the screws must of not pulled in the plank,so they drilled another hole just below it.if you were looking at this transom 50 years later you would probably think someone put a lot more extra repair screws into it
Last edited by mcisaac inc on Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Russ Arrand » Sat Apr 12, 2008 6:36 pm

Mark:
Talk to Hal about poor bungs. And get a spell check.
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Post by mcisaac inc » Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:14 pm

i find your personal attacks against me repulsive. you have obviously not read the reminder from bill basler on the rules of this forum.your behavior is obscene,vulgar,slanderous,hatefull and threatening, not to mention childish.i hope he takes action against you.you are embarresment to our boating community.shame on you. .................mark

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Post by mcisaac inc » Sun Apr 13, 2008 6:45 am

back to the original point of this topic, which was to dicuss acbs judging guidelines. it seems that this boat has a 3 point deduction prior to leaving the factory...............mark :?

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Bill Basler
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Post by Bill Basler » Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:21 am

Mark, you are correct. In the past it has been mentioned that some of these boats were specially built for boat shows. True statement. Some were, and this is well documented. However, the documentation typically points to wood selection and quality of finish, such as extra coats of varnish.

These show boats were typically well into a run—hull numbers that were dozens after the boats that were featured in advertising literature. The advertising "photo boats" have also been characterized by others as receiving "special" attention. This is not true and your observation about the bungs on this Capri illustrate that.

The advertising photo boats were not typically prototype boats—they did have many of the rough points worked out. But we have seen many, many examples that show these early "literature" boats as pretty crude in some ways—like the bungs on this Capri.

Also keep in mind that literature production was done much differently in the 50s than today. Our own Brass Bell is printed with scans done via a laser scanner, a press that prints with 250 line screen, on science-fiction grade plates that were etched by a laser. This is a far cry from the 1950s where B&W photos were shot with a copy camera by overlaying the halftone screen of choice, typically about 100 line screen, the press was a one- or two-color press using plates that were developed using films, light sources, burning and dodging type techniques, etc.

Those bungs were probably not labored over then for couple of reasons.
1. They needed a boat for photos, and they needed it "now" to get the literature in process for the upcoming model year.
2. The photos were often heavily retouched. Chris-Craft marketing might have taken a "wait and see" approach. One they were able they were able to view the photo prints, they might have opted to retouch the bungs if they thought them to be a problem. Something this minute was rarely a problem, as the reproduction methods typically hid the small flaws.

Now go back and review some of the planking jobs in the other Purist articles and you will see that these boats were anything but perfect—a far cry from their showboat counterparts.
Last edited by Bill Basler on Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Don Ayers
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Post by Don Ayers » Sun Apr 13, 2008 10:45 am

I can recall one instance where I read on a spec sheet that they told the workmen to use bungs from the same planks on a specific boat. Other than that they went on down the road so to speak. If you think someone was cutting tens of thousands of bugs by hand think again.

See pic

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Post by Al Benton » Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:37 am

The article in BB doesn't include the history of the photo or whether it was used in an advertisement in the past or was found in the archives along with other photos with no particular significants except for their mere existence in a file folder.

I took over 200 photos (should have taken a lot more) at Tavares and they're all saved in a file. Of them, there may be 30 that I would brag about. The rest will remain but will not be shown.

My point is the photo may have been one of many that were kept around but not used, unless their point was "we still use real bungs".

I noticed something on Matt's '41 19' Custom in Florida. When the bright afternoon sun over-lighting the original topsides wood, each plank looked like they were not very carefully matched, however, when a cloud drifted by, defusing the direct sunlight it looked beautiful again.

In the subject photo, I'm guessing the bungs would practically disappear, given correct lighting for that shot. They're more visible to the left, where light is catching the wood grain of the bungs differently from the wood they are installed into. Just some thoughts.

Al

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Post by Don Ayers » Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:42 am

Al;

You are exactly right and it matters a great deal on how a subject is viewed vs how lighting is used for a photograph.
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Post by mcisaac inc » Sun Apr 13, 2008 12:31 pm

i have spent hours cutting bungs and matching lumber to try and make these bungs blend in. the whole process of bunging seems to be imperfect in nature, just as wood is. it is nice to see that chris craft had these same problems. i guess with the exception of show boats it was not that big of a deal.................mark
Last edited by mcisaac inc on Sun Apr 13, 2008 8:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Al Benton » Sun Apr 13, 2008 1:40 pm

About a year and a half ago, I met Chris Smith for the first time while he was in St. Louis for a family reunion. He was asked about what he could recall about bungs, their mass production, selection of wood, etc.

His answer was that, although bungs were not likely to be cut from scraps of the same piece of wood, that they were very deliberate about matching color and grain of wood pieces used in cutting them, that if bungs were being cut for decking, then bungs would be cut from quarter-sawn pieces specifically reserved for them. Each batch of bungs were tagged for specific applications.

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Post by Don Ayers » Sun Apr 13, 2008 1:44 pm

Mark et al;

I'd bet that CC tried the best they could to turn out a quality product. My best guess is that they had such an inventory of wood they were pretty darn good at having a uniform color and grain. They might have had several buckets of bungs to choose from, some darker than others and vise versa. If you were planking boats and putting bungs in all day long every day I'd bet you would develop a keen eye for matching up color and grain.

Just my two cents

Check this close up of a "show boat" (way over used term) at the 1939 NY show. Not only are the bungs imperfect but look at that wood selection on the upper plank. Flat sawn! OY!

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steve bunda
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bungs

Post by steve bunda » Sun Apr 13, 2008 6:13 pm

The bung question in the maufacturing theater will allways be a interesting question based on how busy the floor was and the skill of their personal. Variables like summer help,the production schedule, and the dreaded monday or friday boats brings me to the conclusion that each boat built has diffrent birth marks, also each and every hull is unique and special in their own way. This started from the day they are born, now factor in 50 or so years of use or abuse and no two boats are the same...........TRIVIA Question,,When did Chris Craft scrap wood bungs and use putty in place? steve

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Post by mcisaac inc » Sun Apr 13, 2008 8:05 pm

don, when i worked with lord danenberg , he would spend a lot of time sorting through lumber. because of its banana shape, the sheer planks short grain at the stem would break off easier .we always tried to pick one that started out quarter sawn and rolled into flat sawn at the stem. of coarse, you need a lot of lumber to choose from. i think that is why that plank was chosen..............mark

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Post by MikeM » Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:41 am

Don,
I sense a little "Bill Baldwin" in your "OY" (and I like it).
Mike
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steve bunda
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Bung Maker

Post by steve bunda » Mon Apr 14, 2008 7:18 pm

to Don and all, I would love to know what year that Drill press is and would like to see the cutter head, I bet it has a spring mechanism to eject the clean bungs to the Star Board and the saw dust port. Did you notice the mahogany blanks on the floor? thanks ,steve ,,, could you imagine do this today with a CNC.

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Post by Russ Arrand » Mon Apr 14, 2008 7:19 pm

Mark: Childish? Obscene? Vulgar? I think not. All of that is true from you. Look back on your own actions.
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Post by 3ngin33r1 » Mon Apr 14, 2008 7:29 pm

Get a room!
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Post by mcisaac inc » Mon Apr 14, 2008 8:51 pm

:D my guess to the trivia question is 1965...............mark

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steve bunda
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trivia

Post by steve bunda » Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:23 pm

Hi , The wood bungs were eliminated for a time and then gone back to for full production,, Hope everyone is having good varnish weather, still lots of ice on Lake Lucernce. steve

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Post by Chris Hall » Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:15 am

mcisaac inc wrote:don, when i worked with lord danenberg
Haha---"Lord Danenberg"...haven't heard that one before!
Chris Hall

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