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Recommended KBL Engine Oil

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Riviera Wish
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Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by Riviera Wish » Tue Nov 20, 2018 3:59 pm

It has been several years since I researched this topic; at that time ,several years ago, I selected Chevron Delo 400 SAE 30 as the choice for my KBL engine. Now in researching the best engine oil for the old flat head Chris Craft engines I am not able to verify that Chevron Delo is a good selection. There are numerous synthetic oils with ZZDP (zinc) additives, and multi-weight oils which seem to be a better choice for an old KBL CC engine. The purpose of this post is to stimulate some discussion on the best engine oil(s) for the old CC flat head engines. Let the discussions begin!

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Captain Nemo
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by Captain Nemo » Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:21 pm

First you can rule out any synthetic oils because they are too slippery for the reverse gear to operate as it shares oil w/ the crankcase. I would recommend using a non-detergent oil if you are not running an oil filter. A characteristic of a detergent oil is to suspend all the gunk and stuff to carry it to the filter thus having all that floating around the inside of your engine with out a filter. The non-detergent oil allows all the crud to settle into the pan to be sucked out at the next oil change. You can buy a ZDDP additive also is a good idea.
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by Bilge Rat » Wed Nov 21, 2018 8:13 am

I've been using a ZDDP additive to conventional detergent SAE 30 oil. I have been doing this after a complete rebuild of the engine and I use a full-flow oil filter.
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Riviera Wish
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by Riviera Wish » Thu Nov 22, 2018 12:39 pm

Good point that synthetics are "too slippery" for the reverse gear operation. Since I do not run any filter my best bet would be to run a non-detergent oil if I understand the comments correctly. Some oils contain ZDDP in varying amounts; I understand that 1200ppm is required for the old flat head engines. Does anyone know if any 'stock' oils contain sufficient ZDDP for the old Chris Craft flat head engines? Also, suggestions of SAE 30, which the engine calls for, or multi-weight oil is best?

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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by jim g » Sat Nov 24, 2018 1:57 pm

Straight 30 weight. The flat heads don't get hot enough for the use of multi weight oil. If the engine has been rebuilt recently i.e. Around the last 10 or so years. use a detergent oil. The detergent oil keeps the dirt particles suspended. Run your engine and get it good and warm then change your oil at the end of each season.

The reason for non detergent oil is if the engine hasn't been into in 20 or more years the detergent oil will break up all that sludge caked up in the engine.

I use Brad Penn 30 weight oil in all my customers old Chris Craft engines. Make sure its not Break in Oil as its made in the same weight.

Penn oil is made in the old Kendall oil refinery. Its waht the old racers called the green oil. Best stuff that was ever made. All the European car makers used that oil here in the U.S. until the Kendall name was sold off in the early 90's.

https://www.amazon.com/Brad-Penn-009-71 ... nn+30w+oil

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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by Matt Smith » Sat Nov 24, 2018 2:37 pm

I have some engines that call for 40 and then some 30. Its on the tag on your manafold. Factory tells you! I use Rotiel by Shell. Its great. But since there are no Oil filters, I change twice a year regardless.
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by jim g » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:49 pm

Chris Craft changed their recommendation from 40w to 30w for all engines in 1955.

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Matt Smith
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by Matt Smith » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:31 pm

So, here is a question then. Was it because of better oil, or a change in engine design? Its fair to say that a pre war engine would have been a tad more loose? I ask this because is todays 30 wt the same as 1945's 30 Weight? I smell a story here.
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steve bunda
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by steve bunda » Sat Nov 24, 2018 7:12 pm

My mentor Jim who is an expert on old Hercules engines recommends Valvoline straight Racing 50 weight . This is for the engines that have not been rebuilt.

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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by jim g » Sun Nov 25, 2018 1:53 am

Matt Smith wrote:
Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:31 pm
So, here is a question then. Was it because of better oil, or a change in engine design? Its fair to say that a pre war engine would have been a tad more loose? I ask this because is todays 30 wt the same as 1945's 30 Weight? I smell a story here.
30w is 30w. The additives in todays oil are much better. The Penn oil has the correct ZDDP in it.

They went to 30w because of better machining.

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drrot
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by drrot » Sun Nov 25, 2018 9:53 am

Have Jim G write it.
jim g wrote:
Sun Nov 25, 2018 1:53 am
Matt Smith wrote:
Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:31 pm
So, here is a question then. Was it because of better oil, or a change in engine design? Its fair to say that a pre war engine would have been a tad more loose? I ask this because is todays 30 wt the same as 1945's 30 Weight? I smell a story here.
30w is 30w. The additives in todays oil are much better. The Penn oil has the correct ZDDP in it.

They went to 30w because of better machining.
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Matt Smith
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by Matt Smith » Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:07 am

This turned out to be a fun story.. Thanks guys ! http://www.woodyboater.com/blog/2018/11 ... ry-simple/
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by tkhersom » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:44 am

This subject always makes for a GREAT conversation.

Here are a couple of other threads on the subject from the past.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8420
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=9679
Troy in ANE - Former President CCABC

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https://www.chris-craft.org/boats/22625/
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https://www.chris-craft.org/boats/22607/
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John Cederstrom
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by John Cederstrom » Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:29 am

One of the posts regarding the use of Brad Penn 30 wt engine oil in classic flat head engines was to make sure you don't use Brad Penn 30 wt break-in oil. The only thing I see different in the oils is the addition of proper levels of ZDDP in the break=in oil. Is there harm in using the break-in oil on a long term basis? As I see it, you wouldn't have to add any further ZDDP additive to the oil. What am I missing? John C

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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by jim g » Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:13 pm

John Cederstrom wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:29 am
One of the posts regarding the use of Brad Penn 30 wt engine oil in classic flat head engines was to make sure you don't use Brad Penn 30 wt break-in oil. The only thing I see different in the oils is the addition of proper levels of ZDDP in the break=in oil. Is there harm in using the break-in oil on a long term basis? As I see it, you wouldn't have to add any further ZDDP additive to the oil. What am I missing? John C
Break in oil has friction enhancers to help seat in all of the new components in your rebuilt engine. You run break in oil in a frshly rebuilt engine for about 15 hours. Which would be about 1500 miles. Chris Craft issued a service bulletin in the 60's that said 100 hours is equal to 10,000 miles on a car engine.

After you run the the engine for the break in period. Change the oil and put in Brad Penn 30 weight oil. Regular Penn 30 weight has the proper amount of ZDDP for long term use.

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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by John Cederstrom » Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:51 pm

Thanks for clearing that up for me. My Chrysler M-27 engine came with the Garwood Ensign I''m restoring. I have to assume it's been a long time since anyone has seen the engine interior. Based on this info I'll plan on using 30 wt Brad Penn without any additional ZDDP additive. John C

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SportNWood
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by SportNWood » Thu Apr 18, 2019 12:19 pm

I am in Florida and am using Shell Rotella 40W in my "K" engine. The factory recommended 30W but As we are a much warmer climate here in FL, I have opted for 40W.

Any thoughts on using the thicker 40w vs the original 30w?

Thank you,

Niel
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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by John Cederstrom » Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:10 am

I guess I'm still out to sea regarding engine oils. Brad Penn 30 wt high performance oil and Rotella straight 30 wt oil both seem to indicate that they are detergent oils. Is this true? I prefer to use a single grade non-detergent oil in my M-27 engine as I can only assume it's been a long time since last rebuild.. Valvoline is the only brand that I've found that states their single grade oils are non-detergent.
John C

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Re: Recommended KBL Engine Oil

Post by jim g » Mon Apr 22, 2019 9:47 pm

John Cederstrom wrote:
Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:10 am
I guess I'm still out to sea regarding engine oils. Brad Penn 30 wt high performance oil and Rotella straight 30 wt oil both seem to indicate that they are detergent oils. Is this true? I prefer to use a single grade non-detergent oil in my M-27 engine as I can only assume it's been a long time since last rebuild.. Valvoline is the only brand that I've found that states their single grade oils are non-detergent.
John C
Valvoline has both detergent and non detergent single weight oil.

You can also buy it in NAPA brand for less money. Napa brand oil is made by Ashland which is the parent company of Valvoline.

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