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Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

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Riviera Wish
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Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Riviera Wish » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:16 pm

My hull card for '52 Riviera #749 indicates 8 small cleats were provided by the factory. Based on research I assume these cleats were used to retain a boat cover. In this regard, can anyone tell me the pattern for, or a supplier of, the cover that was used on the CC Riviera? Also, where exactly were the locations of the cleats? What is particularly confusing is that the hull card for the Riviera indicates a cover "to waterline" which seems to contradict the purpose of the cleats which I assume would be mounted on the periphery of the deck. Can anyone shed light on this cleats/ cover dilemma?
In addition I would like to provoke a discussion of fenders for the Riviera. What size and type are recommended for the 18' Riviera, and are the cleats adequate for hanging the fenders?

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maritimeclassics
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by maritimeclassics » Wed Oct 31, 2018 7:16 am

The cleats were fender or bumper cleats and not for the cover. The cover was nothing really different then the ones we have made today other that the material back then was some kind of canvas and today we use sunbrella. I have a few pictures of the fender cleat location if you need that information.
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Greg Wallace
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Greg Wallace » Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:30 am

These cleats were used to secure factory covers. They were indeed fender cleats but I have seen orders were additional cleats were spec'd to enhance cover retention. The covers had a square piece of vinyl sewn at each cleat location with two parallel stitch lines through the middle above where the cleat would be underneath the cover. A slit could be made between these stitch lines allowing cleat to protrude. There was a canvas loop sewn adjacent with a piece of cotton cording to tie to the protruding cleat thus securing the cover to the cleat. Factory covers were duck canvas and could be ordered to terminate at gunnel or extend to waterline. "Shipping" covers were expected to be returned to factory.
Greg Wallace 23 Custom 22166 former Chris-Craft dealer Russells Point, Oh.

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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Greg Wallace » Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:34 am

Additionally, when a factory cover was spec'd there was typically a small bronze (chromed) hook-like retainer installed on the transom band to secure the cover at the transom via another set of cotton cords attached to a canvas loop.
Greg Wallace 23 Custom 22166 former Chris-Craft dealer Russells Point, Oh.

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maritimeclassics
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by maritimeclassics » Wed Oct 31, 2018 8:48 am

Not sure I ever saw a factory cover. Do you have any pictures of the cover using the fender cleats?
Family member of Chris Craft founder
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Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Sportsman
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1930 28' Dodge Watercar
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1947 30' Wilber Ketchum Launch
1940 18' 6 Century Triple

Bob B
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Bob B » Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:59 am

We're 2nd owner our CC Deluxe. First owner was next door and as a kid I remember it had a tan canvas cover with trimmed slits and cords for the cleats just as Greg W. described. Cover is long gone but cleats are still perfect for fenders. Sorry, no pictures but I remember it was not a tight fit, just loosely covered and kept out the rain and sun on top, not on the sides. Hull card specifies small cleats, but no mention of cover.

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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Greg Wallace » Wed Oct 31, 2018 11:10 am

I'll check, but not likely. Would have been accidental. These covers were rotten and gone long before anybody cared enough to document. May have some photos of "storage" building or boat houses with covered boats that might show this detail.
Greg Wallace 23 Custom 22166 former Chris-Craft dealer Russells Point, Oh.

Riviera Wish
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Riviera Wish » Wed Oct 31, 2018 11:34 am

Thanks for all of your replies. I have requested photos from Maritime Classics with regard to the location of the cleats. There is a photo in CHRIS-CRAFT BOATS which shows the approximate location of 6 cleats on an 18' Riviera but I don't know if this photo is true to CC production, and it does not show all 8 of the cleats provided per my hull card.
In the previous posts the use of these cleats for hanging fenders is acknowledged. Can anyone indicate the size (diameter and length) of fenders recommended for the 18' Riviera? Also a discussion of the number of fenders required for various situations would be informative.

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maritimeclassics
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by maritimeclassics » Wed Oct 31, 2018 1:42 pm

Here is a 20' that we did a few years back.
IMG_20160618_122005834_HDR.jpg
IMG_20160618_121926971_HDR.jpg
IMG_20160618_122005834_HDR.jpg
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Family member of Chris Craft founder
http://www.maritimeclassics.com
Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Sportsman
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1930 28' Dodge Watercar
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1947 30' Wilber Ketchum Launch
1940 18' 6 Century Triple

Riviera Wish
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Riviera Wish » Wed Oct 31, 2018 2:17 pm

Mike, in an earlier post you indicated that you had 'photos of the cleat locations'. I don't see any cleats in the pictures that you posted on the 20' Riviera. Could you post the photos with the locations of the cleats? Thanks

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maritimeclassics
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by maritimeclassics » Wed Oct 31, 2018 2:25 pm

They are on there but there's only 4. If you click on the photo it will in-large and click on it again and it will zoom. On this boat there is only 2 on each side and that's the way I would do it if the boat was mine. There is one just in front of the windshield and then one just behind the hatch. I would not put one in the middle because someone could trip over it getting into the boat. I see on some boats they put them all the way aft by the transom but this is useless because the bumper wants to roll out and ends up behind the boat. I am surprised your hull card had 8 on it that would mean 4 on each side and I have never seen that on a Riviera.
Family member of Chris Craft founder
http://www.maritimeclassics.com
Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Sportsman
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1930 28' Dodge Watercar
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1947 30' Wilber Ketchum Launch
1940 18' 6 Century Triple

Bob B
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Bob B » Wed Oct 31, 2018 3:09 pm

8 cleats. Enlarge photo to see 4 on a side. (one on the port side is visible just above sticker on windshield.) I have cord on both ends of fender, hang fender with top cord and run bottom cord to adjacent cleat, fore or aft as required, to prevent "fender creep.)

Bob B
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Bob B » Wed Oct 31, 2018 3:11 pm

Sorry. How do I post photo?
Bob B

Riviera Wish
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Riviera Wish » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:55 pm

Thanks Mike, now that you have 'schooled' me in the use of the photos I see the cleats. It's interesting that they are located inboard on the deck planks; I had thought/assumed the cleats would be more outboard. Your comments on the cleats not being located adjacent to the cockpit and too far aft are well taken.
Bob, I am not the one to tell you how to post a photo, I am the proverbial dinosaur . However, I would like to see where the 8 are located. Maybe I can 'get by' with only 4 for the fenders but can know the location of the other 4 if ever the boat is shown. What size fenders (diameter and length) do you use on your Riviera?

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WoodenRookie
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by WoodenRookie » Thu Nov 01, 2018 8:56 am

Any sources for cleats, Perko has similar at 2" but I think these are 1-3/8" length
59 18' Continental

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Bilge Rat
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Bilge Rat » Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:52 am

Whatever you choose for a cleat, make sure it is a chrome plated bronze item. This is what Chris Craft used back in the day. Many of the more modern PERKO ones are cheap pot metal billed as "zamac" that will eventually pit. A Riviera is worth the extra cost of bronze.
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1953 Chris Craft Sportsman 22 foot "Summerwind"

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maritimeclassics
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by maritimeclassics » Fri Nov 02, 2018 7:43 am

The cleats should look like this.
IMG_20161114_105855008.jpg
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Family member of Chris Craft founder
http://www.maritimeclassics.com
Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Sportsman
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1930 28' Dodge Watercar
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1947 30' Wilber Ketchum Launch
1940 18' 6 Century Triple

Riviera Wish
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Riviera Wish » Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:56 pm

That is how my cleats look. However, in the photo shown, the cleat appears to be within an inch or two of the SS rub rail. This location would be different than the earlier photos of the 20' Riviera which shows the cleats forward of the windshield and aft of the cockpit to be further inboard, i.e. on the deck planking. What kind of boat is in the photo with the cleat just aft of the step plate? Riviera? Is it safe to assume that all Riviera cleats were further inboard on the deck planking? Intuitively it seems that the outboard location(s) would be more practical from the standpoint of fender use. Other CC photos of Cobra, Custom Runabout and Sportsman show the typical cleat location as outboard close to the rub rail.
Still would like some comments on the size of fenders used on Rivieras.

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Don Vogt
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by Don Vogt » Fri Nov 02, 2018 5:34 pm

Mike, it appears the screw heads are aligned in an X rather than a +. Since i have slotted screws on my boat, i hadnt noticed what people do with frearson type screws. Is the X position more or less standard?
1938 Chris Craft 17' Deluxe Runabout "Jennifer II"

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maritimeclassics
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Re: Cleats (small) on '52 Riviera

Post by maritimeclassics » Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:03 am

This is of a boat we are restoring now. On post war boats using phillips or reed and prince screws there is really no correct orientation to the screws. Even with straight slot from the factory they didn't worry about orientation it's something we do now for aesthetics.
Family member of Chris Craft founder
http://www.maritimeclassics.com
Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Sportsman
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1930 28' Dodge Watercar
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1947 30' Wilber Ketchum Launch
1940 18' 6 Century Triple

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