Active Unanswered
Please read: All about the Brass Bell, all in one place!
Moderators: Don Ayers, Al Benton
-
- Posts: 2092
- Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:41 pm
- Location: Powhatan Courthouse Virginia
- Contact:
Maybe the Brass Bell is in the same position as any big wooden cruiser these days. ?
Too expensive to do.
Too few $ to maintain.
Too few zealots to grow.
Too many geezers fading out.
stupid anology? not totally I don't think.
Cruiser boats have it even worse. In this economy gas cost is the equivalent of paper/printing/postage/layout...
Can't give a cruiser away these days...I will treasure mine until it is no more...and will do the same with the Brass Bell.
Thanks to all that care for cruisers and all who publish the Bell, true labors of love, both.
John in Va.
Too expensive to do.
Too few $ to maintain.
Too few zealots to grow.
Too many geezers fading out.
stupid anology? not totally I don't think.
Cruiser boats have it even worse. In this economy gas cost is the equivalent of paper/printing/postage/layout...
Can't give a cruiser away these days...I will treasure mine until it is no more...and will do the same with the Brass Bell.
Thanks to all that care for cruisers and all who publish the Bell, true labors of love, both.
John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
John, a very good analogy actually. But as long as there are a few of us keeping them floating there will be a few of them around. Same with the Brass Bell, there may be fewer supporters for it as time moves along but for now it, like our old wood cruisers, we'll treasure the Brass Bell in our mail boxes until it is no more.
Al
Member - Executive Team
Member - Executive Team
-
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Sun May 27, 2007 6:27 pm
- Location: Marshfield, WI
- Contact:
Brass Bell and related business decisions
Bill,
Good leaders make the tough decisions. I support your changes as well as the proposal to increase dues.
Don Bergman
Good leaders make the tough decisions. I support your changes as well as the proposal to increase dues.
Don Bergman
1941 16' Deluxe Runabout
1959 18' Sea Skiff
1946 22' Sportsman
1959 18' Sea Skiff
1946 22' Sportsman
- Bill Basler
- Posts: 1996
- Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 4:48 pm
- Location: Cedar Rapids, IA
All, an overdue update for all of you. I will bring you mixed news here...good and bad, but it will be an update nonetheless. And I do thank all of you for your input here. I will be updating all of membership via email within the week. This is a current source of "mild gas" as I do have questions to answer here on Boat Buzz, via email for those who are not on Boat Buzz, a few via private messages, some via phone calls and even Facebook. Yes, Facebook is another area that has been growing (good), which in turn creates another conduit through which things flow (bad? Not really bad. Just another conduit).
Believe me, I am a big boy, and I can take the criticism...even much of the blame, but you have my promise that we are working to right the ship and get on an even keel. We are, behind the scenes, making progress.
First the bad news. As you already know the spring issue was held up due to some production and renewal issues. That is old news now, but I will give you an update. At this point in time, several months after we started talking about this issue, we are, unfortunately, still 312 members down as of moments ago. We get a few renewals in per day, but most of these are within the "due now" period and not past dues. I have sent out several very targeted emails to our past due list. I can see in the email reporting how many are opening these emails, how many are clicking links, etc. I am happy to report that the emails are being opened, and apparently read, as the click through on the links is a very high number. But, unfortunately, the efforts have migrated very few off the past due list, and it has taken a lot of time and effort to convert a few folks back into active status.
Now, the better news. The spring issue is printed. And it has been for some time. In fact it has been sitting on palettes for about a month, as we thought through a solution to the sudden drop in membership. The solution was that we would send the spring and summer issues together in one mailing, potentially saving a few thousand dollars on mailing costs alone. Again, the spring issue is printed, and that should help some of you feel a bit more comfortable that your issues are coming.
I am nearly finished with the summer Brass Bell. Late? You bet. But before you shoot the messenger, we had some content that was trickling in as of last week. This is to the fault of no one. We are all volunteers, we're doing the best we can with the resources we have, and I will say that Brian Robinson, Don Ayers, Terry Fiest, Angilla Baccus and a handful of contributors (some of whom are first time contributors, i.e.: Jerri Nowlen) have all done a great job. The summer issue will be off to the printer by Monday, come hell or high water.
Now, what can you expect as we move forward? Well, first of all, we will be changing some processes. We will not be managing Brass Bell production in the exact manner that we have been for the last six issues or so. We will be infusing the process with a bit of new blood. I will push hard to move on to fall—and then winter.
The summer issue? The very late summer issue? It's phenomenal. One of the key features is a retrospective on the very popular post war 20-foot Custom. This is the most extensive retrospective in Brass Bell history. This retrospective will feature the factory hull data from every 20-foot Custom to leave the factory.
We are looking into how to mail these two issues together most economically. Speaking candidly, some of the mailing cost numbers being quoted here are just not relevant to a periodical class magazine of the weight of a Brass Bell. Driving a letter and dropping it into US postal service mail, subsequently having it handled by Canadian Post is one thing. When I refer to mailing costs, I am referring to submitting a database to the mailing house. Then having them pass the data through a mandatory US CASS address certification, print the shipping panels with bar coding, etc, packaging, zip code sorting...and so on...and so on.
Guys, when a Brass Bell issue comes off press, it's not something that goes in a trunk of your car, or the bed of a pickup. It's about 6 palette loads of magazines, hauled by straight trucks, off loaded at the local USPS, transported again to a Canadian Mail broker at the US Canadian border, etc. For those who say this should only be a couple of bucks per issue, I will hire you tomorrow! And I will pay you three.
In fact, as I am writing this, I am demonstrating the obvious. Fuel increases alone on shipping 4,000 (heavy) magazines around the world is significant.
So, I am offering this. Let's stay the course and see if we can get these issues back on track by year end. I will be making some announcements about some new content processes, and new personnel soon. I agree with all of the comments about getting members what is rightfully theirs. I also agree with getting the advertisers what is rightfully theirs. I will be working with each and every one of our advertisers offline. We can smooth that over and compensate advertisers fairly.
As for dues, I do suspect we will have to increase them on the next renewal quarter. I am working to figure out what exactly that increase needs to be.
For everyone of you who have entered into this conversation here on Boat Buzz, I have heard from dozens via email and phone. 49 out of 50 are saying "please don't take the Bell out of print. Figure out what it takes to support it and move on."
Despite this current mess, we continue to attract some new members, and the overall member number is now back over 3,500. We are down, but I think we can get back on solid footing over the course of 2012.
Believe me, I am a big boy, and I can take the criticism...even much of the blame, but you have my promise that we are working to right the ship and get on an even keel. We are, behind the scenes, making progress.
First the bad news. As you already know the spring issue was held up due to some production and renewal issues. That is old news now, but I will give you an update. At this point in time, several months after we started talking about this issue, we are, unfortunately, still 312 members down as of moments ago. We get a few renewals in per day, but most of these are within the "due now" period and not past dues. I have sent out several very targeted emails to our past due list. I can see in the email reporting how many are opening these emails, how many are clicking links, etc. I am happy to report that the emails are being opened, and apparently read, as the click through on the links is a very high number. But, unfortunately, the efforts have migrated very few off the past due list, and it has taken a lot of time and effort to convert a few folks back into active status.
Now, the better news. The spring issue is printed. And it has been for some time. In fact it has been sitting on palettes for about a month, as we thought through a solution to the sudden drop in membership. The solution was that we would send the spring and summer issues together in one mailing, potentially saving a few thousand dollars on mailing costs alone. Again, the spring issue is printed, and that should help some of you feel a bit more comfortable that your issues are coming.
I am nearly finished with the summer Brass Bell. Late? You bet. But before you shoot the messenger, we had some content that was trickling in as of last week. This is to the fault of no one. We are all volunteers, we're doing the best we can with the resources we have, and I will say that Brian Robinson, Don Ayers, Terry Fiest, Angilla Baccus and a handful of contributors (some of whom are first time contributors, i.e.: Jerri Nowlen) have all done a great job. The summer issue will be off to the printer by Monday, come hell or high water.
Now, what can you expect as we move forward? Well, first of all, we will be changing some processes. We will not be managing Brass Bell production in the exact manner that we have been for the last six issues or so. We will be infusing the process with a bit of new blood. I will push hard to move on to fall—and then winter.
The summer issue? The very late summer issue? It's phenomenal. One of the key features is a retrospective on the very popular post war 20-foot Custom. This is the most extensive retrospective in Brass Bell history. This retrospective will feature the factory hull data from every 20-foot Custom to leave the factory.
We are looking into how to mail these two issues together most economically. Speaking candidly, some of the mailing cost numbers being quoted here are just not relevant to a periodical class magazine of the weight of a Brass Bell. Driving a letter and dropping it into US postal service mail, subsequently having it handled by Canadian Post is one thing. When I refer to mailing costs, I am referring to submitting a database to the mailing house. Then having them pass the data through a mandatory US CASS address certification, print the shipping panels with bar coding, etc, packaging, zip code sorting...and so on...and so on.
Guys, when a Brass Bell issue comes off press, it's not something that goes in a trunk of your car, or the bed of a pickup. It's about 6 palette loads of magazines, hauled by straight trucks, off loaded at the local USPS, transported again to a Canadian Mail broker at the US Canadian border, etc. For those who say this should only be a couple of bucks per issue, I will hire you tomorrow! And I will pay you three.
In fact, as I am writing this, I am demonstrating the obvious. Fuel increases alone on shipping 4,000 (heavy) magazines around the world is significant.
So, I am offering this. Let's stay the course and see if we can get these issues back on track by year end. I will be making some announcements about some new content processes, and new personnel soon. I agree with all of the comments about getting members what is rightfully theirs. I also agree with getting the advertisers what is rightfully theirs. I will be working with each and every one of our advertisers offline. We can smooth that over and compensate advertisers fairly.
As for dues, I do suspect we will have to increase them on the next renewal quarter. I am working to figure out what exactly that increase needs to be.
For everyone of you who have entered into this conversation here on Boat Buzz, I have heard from dozens via email and phone. 49 out of 50 are saying "please don't take the Bell out of print. Figure out what it takes to support it and move on."
Despite this current mess, we continue to attract some new members, and the overall member number is now back over 3,500. We are down, but I think we can get back on solid footing over the course of 2012.
Last edited by Bill Basler on Fri Nov 04, 2011 11:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
Bill Basler
-
- Posts: 2092
- Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 10:41 pm
- Location: Powhatan Courthouse Virginia
- Contact:
I have nothing but praise, patience, and sympathy for Bill's work, positon, and candor.
How ANY of these volunteers get all of this done is beyond me. I peck out a few words on this site almost daily...I contribute little else...thanks to those few that do all the heavy lifting.
John in Va.
How ANY of these volunteers get all of this done is beyond me. I peck out a few words on this site almost daily...I contribute little else...thanks to those few that do all the heavy lifting.
John in Va.
1980 Fairchild Scout 30
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
19?? custom Argentine Runabout 16'
1954 Whirlwind deluxe dual ckpt 16'
1921 Old Town Charles River 17' (founding Captain, James River Batteau Festival)
John,
I would like to encourage you to be one of those contributes to a Brass Bell article. I think I speak for most of us on Boat Buzz in saying that we truly enjoy your distinct use of our language in your posts. Having met you and heard your wonderful genuine Virginia accent I can't help but hear it as I read your words of wisdom in every post. I think that Brass Bell readers would truly enjoy reading an article about your experiences with your Cavalier Sea Strake, your passion for her, the railway that you use to pull her out, on and on.
I would like to encourage you to be one of those contributes to a Brass Bell article. I think I speak for most of us on Boat Buzz in saying that we truly enjoy your distinct use of our language in your posts. Having met you and heard your wonderful genuine Virginia accent I can't help but hear it as I read your words of wisdom in every post. I think that Brass Bell readers would truly enjoy reading an article about your experiences with your Cavalier Sea Strake, your passion for her, the railway that you use to pull her out, on and on.
Al
Member - Executive Team
Member - Executive Team
Well Bill the over 3500 number is encouraging compared to a number that you estimated about a month ago. I can't find it but as I recall it was depressing. So considering the things these days that have an affect on participating in a hobby such as classic boating this hobby based club may be doing well until the economy begins meaningful recovery.
Maybe we should count our blessings, lick our wounds, get on with recovery, concentrate on the future and not be discouraged by the past.
Maybe we should count our blessings, lick our wounds, get on with recovery, concentrate on the future and not be discouraged by the past.
Al
Member - Executive Team
Member - Executive Team
- steve bunda
- Posts: 428
- Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 5:59 pm
- Location: wisconsin
- Contact:
Print Brass Bell
Trees make Wood Chris Crafts, Trees make the Brass Bell, Good old Docks are made of Wood. Houses are made of wood. Fine wiskey is made in wood barrels. need I go on? steve and laurie
Last edited by drrot on Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
Jim Staib
www.finewoodboats.com
1947 Penn Yan 12' Cartopper WXH474611
1950 Chris-Craft 22' Sportsman U-22-1532
1957 Chris-Craft 26' Sea Skiff SK-26-515
1968 Century 17' Resorter FG-68-174
www.finewoodboats.com
1947 Penn Yan 12' Cartopper WXH474611
1950 Chris-Craft 22' Sportsman U-22-1532
1957 Chris-Craft 26' Sea Skiff SK-26-515
1968 Century 17' Resorter FG-68-174
- Chad Durren
- Posts: 666
- Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 1:39 pm
- Location: Chicago, Illinois
- Contact:
- steve bunda
- Posts: 428
- Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 5:59 pm
- Location: wisconsin
- Contact:
Brass Bell
Being a magazine collector I love the Brass Bell as it is an excellent resourse in the libary with other mags and countless books. Having the Bell behind with the delivery can be uncomfortable as one never feels caught up and on schedule. Not sure of a good solution,but maybe some of the issues can be downsized with a large annual edition every year. Increasing membership fees can help , along with the sales of past issues. Membership increase is tough and most likly tied to the economy. ps. we are tree farmers with large tracks of wooded lands and sell the pulp wood to companys that produce paper. Logging is a very large part of the northern wisconsin economy! Wood is Good!Keep printing. steve and laurie
Chad, Bill told us the Summer issue will be off to the printer tomorrow, Monday, 11/7/11. If that's true then please tell us you'll return the full pallet (well, less 2 or 3 of course) to be mailed to the rest of us. If it's not true, then send me 12.5 copies, the check has already been delivered.
Al
Member - Executive Team
Member - Executive Team
-
- Posts: 283
- Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 8:34 am
- Location: onekama, mi.
- Contact:
-
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2009 10:13 am
- Contact:
- Don Danenberg
- Posts: 181
- Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2005 9:30 pm
- Location: Manistee, MI
- Contact:
Become a part of the solution, then;
NOTICE that the Brass Bell is just the same antique concept, just as valuable for the same reason!
Raise the DUES!
What Hell, Double them to $70 per YEAR!!!
Quarterly, that would be $17.50, right?
Is this not collectable, even framed and glazed and sold on E-bay, by the page?
NOTICE that the Brass Bell is just the same antique concept, just as valuable for the same reason!
Raise the DUES!
What Hell, Double them to $70 per YEAR!!!
Quarterly, that would be $17.50, right?
Is this not collectable, even framed and glazed and sold on E-bay, by the page?
Im with ya!...I cant imagine anyone that is in this hobby would think $70 is to much....its the cost of a cheap gallon of paint...or 2 cans of varnish.mfine wrote:To be a member of my (any?) local ACBS chapter (and the national org) would be $65 per year and their web presence and publication are not nearly as good as CCABC's. I honestly think the vast majority of members would pay $70 without blinking.
-
- Posts: 189
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:02 am
- Contact:
Brass bell and dues increase
No im sorry but 70 dollars is too much. I love the bell just as 80-90% of the members. But to double the cost is a little too much. 10-15 dollars is acceptable ecspecially when most of us are already p paying national antique boat club plus local chapter dues. Im sorry but if it went to near 70dol. I would drop out. just my two cents..... jeff
We all need to remember that we that participate on Boat Buzz in this thread only represent about one half on one percent of the total membership. I think it's great news that some would stay with a 100% increase in dues but there must be consideration for the other 99.5% of us.
To increase the dues 100% would be disastrous if half or even if fewer of the members don't go along with it. Any increase at all should be justified before it's assessed on members whether it's 1% or 35%. There's no way that I or the club could ever possibly justify doubling the dues or any where close to that amount.
To increase the dues 100% would be disastrous if half or even if fewer of the members don't go along with it. Any increase at all should be justified before it's assessed on members whether it's 1% or 35%. There's no way that I or the club could ever possibly justify doubling the dues or any where close to that amount.
Al
Member - Executive Team
Member - Executive Team
- Chad Durren
- Posts: 666
- Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 1:39 pm
- Location: Chicago, Illinois
- Contact:
You could easily justify any dues increase by increasing the value of the service offered. Things like actually delivering the BB in the same quarter as the issue is titled, actually doing the Buzz upgrades discussed a year ago, getting more info into an archive that is even easier for members to use. It seems lack of funds is severely restricting the club's ability to function let alone improve services.
I think the risk of not increasing revenue is a lot higher than the risk of half the members quitting over $15 or even $35. There are a lot of people paying ACBS $65 so I don't think the assumption they won't pay CCABC $65 is pretty suspect. Do you have any survey data or anything to back up the idea that 99.5% are not willing to pay more? Right now they are paying $35 a year and not getting anything, and by all accounts not to many are complaining about that yet.
I think the risk of not increasing revenue is a lot higher than the risk of half the members quitting over $15 or even $35. There are a lot of people paying ACBS $65 so I don't think the assumption they won't pay CCABC $65 is pretty suspect. Do you have any survey data or anything to back up the idea that 99.5% are not willing to pay more? Right now they are paying $35 a year and not getting anything, and by all accounts not to many are complaining about that yet.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests