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1939 19ft CC barrel

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clarks
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1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by clarks » Wed Jan 04, 2017 9:28 am

working on the interior of this boat, the seat bottoms are missing, they are suppose to be springs with 3 cushions any idea how to finish this , springs or foam?? need some advice

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quitchabitchin
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by quitchabitchin » Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:11 am

I would check with Brian Robinson. He is the Barrel Back guy.
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maritimeclassics
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by maritimeclassics » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:00 am

P1010296.jpg
It should have spring bases. Wire framed with individually bagged springs then horse hair, cotton batting covered in cotton. The material would most likely be leather, maybe a maroon or red. The cushions should be 3 inches thick when finished, there supposed to be a kapok filled cotton bag that has heavy string stitched trough the bag so the kapok stays in place and doesn't end up on one end of the bag. This is a picture of a boat done a few years back.
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maritimeclassics
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by maritimeclassics » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:02 am

P1010319.jpg
Seat backs are horse hair and cotton batting covered in cotton fabric tacked in place, no staples.
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Owner of Maritime Classics
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Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Deluxe Runabout
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1937 25' Chris Craft Custom Runabout

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maritimeclassics
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by maritimeclassics » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:11 am

upholstery BB Cushion.jpg
Most of these pictures came from Brian Robinson or Don Ayers a few years back. We have completed and worked on about 15 different barrel back of all sizes at Maritime Classics and currently working on a 23'. There is a lot more details with the interior so if you need more info we are happy to help.
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Family member of Chris Craft founder
Owner of Maritime Classics
http://www.maritimeclassics.com
Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Deluxe Runabout
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1937 25' Chris Craft Custom Runabout

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Don Vogt
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Don Vogt » Thu Jan 05, 2017 10:15 am

right you are. If doing it as original, dont forget that the tacks are copper-based.
1938 Chris Craft 17' Deluxe Runabout "Jennifer II"

Greg Wallace
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Greg Wallace » Fri Jan 06, 2017 8:39 am

Well, if we are going to slice our peas, tacks were copper and some steel depending on location. I would like to hear from anyone who knows for sure where each was used. It appears from the material spec sheet that around 25% of tacks used for upholstering were steel.
Greg Wallace 23 Custom 22166 former Chris-Craft dealer Russells Point, Oh.

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Don Vogt
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Don Vogt » Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:58 am

Well, greg, getting down to brass tacks, so to speak. I had originally posted copper but got to thinking they had some additional alloy in them as I didnt remember them being quite as soft as they might be if 100% copper, so I changed it. Now I have changed it to copper based, and can correct further depending on what we find out. But to your point, i have a cd somewhere where don ayers did an "autopsy" on the upholstery of, I think, a '38 utility that showed how the upholstery was put together. Don't recall any steel but perhaps you are right as to the barrelback. Was the material list you were referring to the 19 bb runabout in particular?

I will check with nw classic boats. I see Maritime is already into this thread, and perhaps someone can talk to brian robinson, who also has done some barrelbacks, to see his take on this.among the 3, they have seen a lot of these boats go thru their shops. It is also possible that there was a slow transition from copper to presumably less expensive steel during this time period? Certainly there were no staples, that i am aware of.

As to seat backs, my recollection is that at least in '38 they used kapok with the horsehair rather than cotton padding, fwiw. god forbid that someone uses the wrong tacks! Ha. When asked why they were bothering to finish the inside of walls, etc in cathedrals during the middle ages in Europe where nothing could be seen, the reply was "God can see in there." So here we are.
1938 Chris Craft 17' Deluxe Runabout "Jennifer II"

Greg Wallace
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Greg Wallace » Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:36 am

My only reference documentation is 1940-1941 23 and 27 footers. Both show copper and steel. The ratio of steel to copper increases significantly from the smaller to larger boats. In this case the 23 used 25% steel where the 27 called for 42% steel vs. copper. I've seen steel in hidem and crash pad attachment but this was on a later boat.

Without metallurgy testing we cannot be absolutely sure if what Chris Craft was actually calling out as copper was in fact copper. ( "Philippine" Mahogany comes to mind)

I suspect it would be hard to tell copper from brass or bronze after a little patina. I doubt if even the most suspicious judge would deduct (if he could see them).

I also would not be surprised to find a mixed use on any given hull.
Greg Wallace 23 Custom 22166 former Chris-Craft dealer Russells Point, Oh.

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Brian Robinson
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Brian Robinson » Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:45 am

What Mike Green/Maritime Classics said. Interior was a combination of leather and Russialoid (early vinyl). Seating surfaces were typically leather, while the secondary material (forward half of the seat bases, side pockets, welting) was Russialoid. Just like interiors of most 'leather' cars built in the last 50 years. Cushions and crash pad was usually leather. Spanish Maroon leather is available from MBBW and others. Woodies Restorations carries the vinyl match. Or you can just use all leather. Copper and Steel tacks were both used, My general rule of thumb is the steel was "buried" and the copper was exposed. In judging for example, if you could get away with using modern staples, because no judge could find them without pulling other tacks to see them (not going to happen) thats where the steel was. I only keep copper tacks on hand because they go where they might show.

Some Chris-Craft models and factories started using T-5 steel staples in upholstery components in 1955.
-Brian
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1938 Gar Wood 22' Streamliner #6256 Empress
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Don Vogt
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Don Vogt » Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:08 pm

interesting. Dave Lobb's experience in pre-war boats is that he never ran across copper tacks used in the seat upholstery. He uses them to avoid the obvious rust problem. So i guess i stand corrected there. so the great copper vs. steel question continues.
1938 Chris Craft 17' Deluxe Runabout "Jennifer II"

clarks
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by clarks » Fri Jan 06, 2017 6:25 pm

where can i find the springs for the seat bottoms ??

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Don Vogt
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Don Vogt » Fri Jan 06, 2017 6:40 pm

I think the individual springs are generally available. they need to be put together with an external metal frame. if i can find a picture i will post.
1938 Chris Craft 17' Deluxe Runabout "Jennifer II"

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maritimeclassics
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by maritimeclassics » Mon Jan 09, 2017 10:45 am

You should be able to get most things from LeBaron Bonney Company.
Family member of Chris Craft founder
Owner of Maritime Classics
http://www.maritimeclassics.com
Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Deluxe Runabout
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1937 25' Chris Craft Custom Runabout

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Don Ayers
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Don Ayers » Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:39 pm

Hi all

I'm alive and well lurking in the background. Everyone's on the right track.

I made a DVD of how the original interiors were made. Wonder if we could get the club to host it so that all could watch.

Best regards and Happy New Year!

Don Ayers
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maritimeclassics
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by maritimeclassics » Wed Jan 11, 2017 9:44 am

IMG_20170110_083357256.jpg
This is on a the 23' 1941 but it's all I could find that had some written proof. Pretty cool information.
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Family member of Chris Craft founder
Owner of Maritime Classics
http://www.maritimeclassics.com
Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Deluxe Runabout
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1937 25' Chris Craft Custom Runabout

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Don Danenberg
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Don Danenberg » Mon Jan 16, 2017 6:45 pm

Wow,
How does this happen?

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maritimeclassics
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by maritimeclassics » Wed Jan 18, 2017 8:39 am

Don Danenberg wrote:Wow,
How does this happen?
Did I miss something? I don't understand...
Family member of Chris Craft founder
Owner of Maritime Classics
http://www.maritimeclassics.com
Ph# 231-486-6148

Restoration Projects:
1936 25' Gar Wood Custom
1947 Ventnor Hydroplane
1957 17' Deluxe Runabout
1948 25' Chris Craft Sportsman Twin
1959 19' Sliver Arrow Hull #75
1929 26' Chris Craft Custom Runabout
1937 25' Chris Craft Custom Runabout

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Don Danenberg
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Re: 1939 19ft CC barrel

Post by Don Danenberg » Wed Jan 18, 2017 9:59 pm

Yup..,
Once again, you missed something.

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